[sudo-discuss] It's Unconscionable
Anon195714
anon195714 at sbcglobal.net
Fri Mar 1 19:37:45 PST 2013
Yo's-
I think Eddan's reasoning is sound and JD's letter hits all the right
points.
It might be kinda' fun to have lockpicking competitions:
For example: here's a series of locks from easy to extremely difficult:
how many can each person pick? And, here's a medium-difficult lock: who
can pick it fastest? And, here are ten locks, you have five minutes to
pick as many as you can: who picks the most locks?
Make it a sport. Just like sport shooting contests, skeet shooting, and
target shooting at the rifle range. Nothing wrong with that.
"Lock picks don't burgle houses, people do."
-G.
=====
On 13-03-01-Fri 3:23 PM, Eddan wrote:
> I see it somewhat differently, and think the Workshop Weekend letter
> was thoughtful and appropriate, given the circumstances.
>
> I think the letter was most effective in almost completely narrowing a
> public debate that quickly spun ridiculously out of proportion and
> corrected the gross misrepresentation of the first stories covering
> it. It makes a lot of sense in terms of being sensitive to the
> particular climate in Oakland right now, and I didn't get the
> impression that it was apologetic about actually holding the workshop.
> In fact, they(we)'re going forward with holding it even after the
> Police Chief himself came out publicly saying it was wrong in no
> uncertain terms and the Mayor officially disassociating herself from
> the initiative. To stand stubbornly firm in the context of a fatal
> shooting at the last Art Murmur over rhetorical leeway would likely be
> seen as insensitive and provocative.
>
> All the sincere stuff about building skills and teaching a way of
> thinking would get totally lost in the mainstream media cloud. The
> editors are unsurprisingly having fun with the headlines. /See/ SF
> Weekly - "Mayor Jean Quan Promotes Lock-Picking Classes, Gives Young
> Burglars a Chance to Succeed"
> [http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2013/02/mayor_jean_quan_offers_lock-pi.php]
>
> It was smart to leave the core explanation of why this is important to
> a block-quote by T.O.O.O.L., who teach the class. I also think it was
> a smart move to pull back from selling the kits this time around - no
> use getting the education meme sullied by claims of commercial
> opportunism. It would be cynical not to concede that selling
> lock-picking paraphernalia alongside lock-picking lessons could
> reasonably be seen as inappropriate encouragement. It's not about
> being right - our ultimate goal is to actually engage with the
> community meaningfully, right?
>
>
> All that having been said, I have not hidden my opinion that Sudo Room
> should also publish a statement, as the community hosting the event in
> our common space. I'm interested to find out if that sense is shared
> by others and even more importantly, legitimately opposed.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 11:43 AM, Michael Scroggins
> <michaeljscroggins at gmail.com <mailto:michaeljscroggins at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> In my opinion, the letter is overly apologetic. Neither Workshop
> Weekend nor SudoRoom has done anything that needs to be apologized
> for. Apologizing for the way the workshop was advertised implies
> there is something wrong with the holding a public lock picking
> workshop, which there is not. I wouldn't cede the rhetorical high
> ground on this point.
>
> I love the TOOL statement. I think it strikes exactly the right
> note. If there is to be a SudoRoom statement (does there need to
> be?) I think it should be in line with the TOOL statement.
>
> Michael
>
> J.D. Zamfirescu wrote:
>> For those interested, Workshop Weekend (that is, my brother and
>> I) prepared the following statement on the lockpicking issue. We
>> fully support Sudo Room having its own statement on the issue too.
>>
>> ===========
>>
>> Over the past two days, Workshop Weekend has received complaints
>> from concerned citizens of Oakland about the upcoming
>> "Introduction to Lockpicking" workshop being offered as part of
>> Workshop Weekend on March 2, 2013. The workshop will run as
>> scheduled, but in response to community concerns, lock-picking
>> tools will no longer be offered for sale at the event.
>>
>>
>> As Oakland residents ourselves, we have felt Oakland's crime
>> problem, and we appreciate the community's concerns that offering
>> a lock-picking workshop appears to encourage crime and sends the
>> wrong message. We recognize now that it was insensitive to have
>> the workshop listed and broadcast in the way that it was, and we
>> regret doing so.
>>
>>
>> To provide some background, Workshop Weekend invited The Open
>> Organization of Lockpickers (TOOOL) to run a workshop about
>> lock-picking and lock mechanisms this weekend.
>>
>>
>> Exploring lock-picking and understanding the limitations of locks
>> is valuable for everyone who relies on locks for physical
>> security, and in kids it can spark an interest in mechanical
>> engineering and complex systems.
>>
>>
>> We would also like to share the following note from TOOOL, the
>> group offering the session: "We in TOOOL are of course sensitive
>> to the concern that occasionally surrounds our lock-themed
>> workshops. We can only hope that the atmosphere of openness,
>> information sharing, and strong ethical standards which is a part
>> of all TOOOL meetings can assuage some concerns. Knowing about
>> the weaknesses in certain locks protects the public; it does not
>> aid criminals. Please visit our website -- toool.us
>> <http://toool.us> -- for more information."
>>
>>
>> We hope this note makes things clear to everyone; our goal is
>> provide an educational and inclusive experience for everyone in
>> Oakland who would like to be involved with our events.
>>
>>
>> /Workshop Weekend is a two-day celebration of hands-on learning
>> taking place in the heart of downtown Oakland, bringing together
>> kids and adults from Oakland as well as the rest of the Bay Area.
>> The event encourages exploration of new interests and passions by
>> offering over 40 workshops in subjects not typically taught in
>> schools, including aeroponics, electronics, and 3D printing. For
>> more information, visit workshopweekend.net
>> <http://workshopweekend.net>/
>>
>>
>> We welcome your thoughts and comments at
>> feedback at workshopweekend.net <mailto:feedback at workshopweekend.net>
>>
>> ===========
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 6:44 PM, J.D. Zamfirescu
>> <zamfire at gmail.com <mailto:zamfire at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Michael, you're not missing anything -- we haven't finished
>> drafting the workshop weekend statement yet. :)
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 6:43 PM, Michael Scroggins
>> <michaeljscroggins at gmail.com
>> <mailto:michaeljscroggins at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I must have missed something in the email chain as I am
>> unaware of the Workshop Weekend letter. Of course, you
>> are right that the two letters should match, especially
>> in front of the media. I can't help to think, though,
>> that this is an opportunity to drive home the broader
>> point that neither curiosity nor association is a crime.
>>
>>
>>
>> Eddan Katz wrote:
>>> Seems to me like sticking to correcting the misuse of
>>> the word unconscionable can be respectful to the police
>>> chief and informative about the difference between
>>> skills and criminal intent.
>>>
>>> If Sudo Room does a separate statement, it should follow
>>> on Workshop Weekend's letter and support its posture and
>>> position.
>>>
>>> There'll be TV cameras there this weekend - we can feel
>>> pretty confident about that. It would be very useful to
>>> share a common understanding in order not to have our
>>> purpose misrepresented.
>>>
>>>
>>> sent from eddan.com <http://eddan.com>
>>>
>>> On Feb 28, 2013, at 6:07 PM, Michael Scroggins
>>> <michaeljscroggins at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:michaeljscroggins at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think a statement is well and proper. I also think
>>>> arguing the right to disinterest inquiry is the proper
>>>> line.
>>>>
>>>> To the earlier back and forth about "known gang
>>>> members" ... one of the differences between the people
>>>> at SudoRoom and "known gang members" is simply that to
>>>> be classified as "known" is to be stripped of your
>>>> right to disinterested inquiry. All of your actions
>>>> having been prejudged as interested and malicious.
>>>>
>>>> If the letter is worded right we can make a statement
>>>> about the lock picking class and about the direction
>>>> policing in Oakland has taken.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Michael
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Eddan Katz wrote:
>>>>> J.D. - do you think there should be an additional
>>>>> statement from Sudo Room?
>>>>>
>>>>> Before we proceed any further - does anyone have
>>>>> objections to writing such a letter or signing on to
>>>>> it? What the statement says is another matter for
>>>>> which Sudo member objections should also feel
>>>>> empowered to raise. Comments can be made anonymously
>>>>> on the etherpad or on IRC, if someone isn't
>>>>> comfortable doing it on the list.
>>>>>
>>>>> sent from eddan.com <http://eddan.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 28, 2013, at 5:15 PM, "J.D. Zamfirescu"
>>>>> <zamfire at gmail.com <mailto:zamfire at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Yeah, we were hoping to publish it tonight. Let me
>>>>>> try to draft something and send it on?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Part of me is concerned about editing a public
>>>>>> statement on a public list...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Eddan
>>>>>> <eddan at clear.net <mailto:eddan at clear.net>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> J.D. - where were you thinking of publishing this
>>>>>> letter?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think it would make for a stronger and more
>>>>>> thoughtful response if there was a collective
>>>>>> voice signing on to it either as a group or
>>>>>> listed as individuals.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the help of the collective editorial prowess
>>>>>> of the Sudo list, do you think you would be ready
>>>>>> to publish it before tomorrow morning?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 5:09 PM, Eddan
>>>>>> <eddan at clear.net <mailto:eddan at clear.net>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think the question is, rather - Can you get
>>>>>> hired by a locksmith company without knowing
>>>>>> how to pick a lock?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 5:01 PM,
>>>>>> <thadwooster at gmail.com
>>>>>> <mailto:thadwooster at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I could be totally wrong on this, but I
>>>>>> believe locksmiths are required to be
>>>>>> bonded, fingerprinted and licensed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Feb 28, 2013, at 4:59 PM, rusty
>>>>>> lindgren wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> WTF #@*)DKLJ
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I sent an email to that newb at the
>>>>>>> newspaper... UM, where do they think
>>>>>>> locksmiths learn stuff? Should they
>>>>>>> have to pay to become a locksmith???
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So stupid.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 4:56 PM, Marina
>>>>>>> Kukso <marina.kukso at gmail.com
>>>>>>> <mailto:marina.kukso at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ftfy!: THIS is unconscionable.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 4:50 PM,
>>>>>>> Eddan <eddan at clear.net
>>>>>>> <mailto:eddan at clear.net>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now, this requires a response.
>>>>>>> Has anybody started drafting
>>>>>>> something? If not, I will.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Oakland Police Chief Howard
>>>>>>> Jordan
>>>>>>> <http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=bayarea&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Howard+Jordan%22> was
>>>>>>> not pleased.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "I'm in shock that people would
>>>>>>> provide a class to teach people
>>>>>>> a skill to violate the law,"
>>>>>>> Jordan said. "It's unconscionable."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lock-pick instructor Michael
>>>>>>> Fitzhugh
>>>>>>> <http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=bayarea&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Michael+Fitzhugh%22> is
>>>>>>> a member of TOOOL (The Open
>>>>>>> Organisation Of Lockpickers
>>>>>>> <http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=bayarea&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Open+Organisation+Of+Lockpickers%22>),
>>>>>>> a Netherlands-based outfit that
>>>>>>> teaches and holds national and
>>>>>>> international lock-picking
>>>>>>> events annually. In their world,
>>>>>>> lock picking is done for sport
>>>>>>> and bragging rights. But, he
>>>>>>> says, it's also a useful tool if
>>>>>>> you lock yourself out of your home.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jordan has a more conventional
>>>>>>> solution to that problem: "Call
>>>>>>> a locksmith!"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Quan-s-wrong-note-on-lock-picking-class-4318130.php
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Even worse than Quan, this guy's
>>>>>>> so desperate to change the
>>>>>>> subject about the incompetence
>>>>>>> of the OPD in news story after
>>>>>>> news story.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Unconscionable!?! This coming
>>>>>>> from a police department that
>>>>>>> was about to go into an
>>>>>>> unprecedented federal
>>>>>>> receivership for its failure to
>>>>>>> reform; not to mention a police
>>>>>>> department seared with a global
>>>>>>> reputation for brutality,
>>>>>>> racism, and excessive means; and
>>>>>>> whose fundamental
>>>>>>> miscalculations and
>>>>>>> mismanagement of the response to
>>>>>>> Occupy cost the city millions of
>>>>>>> dollars.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>>>> <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>>>>>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>>>> <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>>>>>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rusty Lindgren
>>>>>>> **
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> sudo-discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>>>> <mailto:sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org>
>>>>>>> http://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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