[sudo-discuss] RAYC's membership

Mon Feb 2 06:47:04 PST 2015

Idunno you can't just drop "have stated that RAYC's presence is a major
reason why they don't come to Omni anymore" and not clarify it at all. If
you're not able to explain in some way, then don't bring it into the
discussion. Dropping dark hints with no elaboration helps no one.

As far as RAYC goes, I've known him for the few years that I have visited
bay area hackerspaces, and while he is problematic at times, he is also one
of the few people who really spends most of their time cleaning and
improving the space. If there are reasons to block him that outweigh his
work, let's hear them.

-Jehan

On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 2:46 PM, Danny Spitzberg <stationaery at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Niki, I agree that it's important to approach new folks - apologies if my
> earlier message was less than loving.  I was happy and appreciative at
> first with RAYC, but it became much too much. I'll add that other
> individuals I've spoken with have stated that RAYC's presence is a major
> reason why they don't come to Omni anymore (happy to clarify on that
> off-thread).
>
> <3<4<5,
> D
>
>
>
> On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 2:09 PM, niki <niki.shelley at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm glad that there are people here who are looking out / engaging
>> w/people they don't know, honestly.
>>
>> I'll talk to RAYC about the "enthusiasm" with which he does so. I'd
>> encourage others in the community to do the same. Let's recognize that RAYC
>> does seem to have the community's best interests at heart and to
>> communicate lovingly.
>>
>> <3
>>
>> N
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 1:55 PM, Danny Spitzberg <stationaery at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I believe I met RAYC last Tuesday - 5'10"ish, short hair, rapid talker -
>>> he got all up in my face repeatedly as I was doing inventory of a/v
>>> equipment for the Omni wiki. I was clearly using a clipboard and camera
>>> with intention to record info, working with Kwe, but RAYC hit me with a
>>> litany of questions lik,e Hey are you new here, Hey are you looking for
>>> anyone, Hey can I help you find something... As if he was security at his
>>> own club house. I told him repeatedly what I was doing and why and said
>>> thanks but no thanks for his help and he persisted.
>>>
>>>  No harm no foul, I guess, but that was super-duper aggravating.
>>>
>>>  I'm unclear what RAYC's status is with Sudo and/or Omni, but wanted to
>>> add this for the record.
>>>
>>> Happy Sunday!
>>>
>>> D
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 8, 2015 at 12:28 PM, Torrie Fischer <
>>> tdfischer at hackerbots.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Feel free to try throwing more mediation at RAYC. You'll be sorely
>>>> disappointed.
>>>>
>>>> We tried for months to talk him down and convince him that there was no
>>>> conspiracy. Mitch tried to have a meeting with him to talk about it but
>>>> RAYC
>>>> disrespected Mitch's time by canceling a few minutes before it started.
>>>> I
>>>> personally wandered around in the mission until 2am with him while I
>>>> tried to
>>>> talk with him and convince him that while we all love him and are
>>>> appreciative
>>>> of his contributions, he needs to take a vacation. Instead I got
>>>> screamed at
>>>> and told that I'm part of the problem.
>>>>
>>>> Noisebridge has collectively addressed the problem by excluding him
>>>> from
>>>> participation in the community. We tried. He is physically incapable of
>>>> receiving mediation.
>>>>
>>>> On Thursday, January 08, 2015 12:16:06 PM Sam Tepper wrote:
>>>> > There are many complaints that NB members (and a few sudo co-members)
>>>> > have against Rayc. Not all of them are valid, but we should not
>>>> > oversimplify this out of respect for everyone's perceptions and
>>>> > viewpoints. Rayc certainly will need to make a written statement (as
>>>> > was mentioned at the meeting), which should resolve some of this and
>>>> > take it to a more factual realm.
>>>> >
>>>> > From my understanding, there have been some attempts at NB for
>>>> > conflict mediation, yet nobody has fully followed through with the
>>>> > process. The issues are involved enough that I believe that agreeing
>>>> > upon a moderator or mediator, in this case, might be appropriate.
>>>> >
>>>> > Rayc has certainly contributed positively to Sudo and NB, yet there
>>>> > are certain specific actions and incidents which perhaps still need
>>>> to
>>>> > be addressed.
>>>> >
>>>> > On 01/08/2015 11:55 AM, hol at gaskill.com wrote:
>>>> > > That's what people felt - we needed more time to establish how he
>>>> > > intends to use the space and interact w/ others. Also discussed was
>>>> > > that really, we should probably take this time for ALL new members
>>>> > > instead of just giving it a week.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Please anyone interested consider proposing amendments to our
>>>> > > membership process:
>>>> > >
>>>> https://sudoroom.org/wiki/Articles_of_Association#Section_2.1.0_Process_fo
>>>> > > r_becoming_a_member>
>>>> > > Here are some notes from noisebridge meetings below, just did a
>>>> > >
>>>> > > little digging today
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Banned for 6 months - agrees to stay out for that time:
>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_03_11
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Comes up for perma-ban, which is blocked:
>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_03_18
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Discussion for 2 meetings RE unbanning:
>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_04_22
>>>> > > https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2014_04_29
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Sounds like one of the main people pushing for his ban was also
>>>> > > banned and/or removed from the 'council' but either way, the
>>>> > > consensus was that we will proceed with an open mind and listen to
>>>> > > all the facts.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Cheers
>>>> > >
>>>> > > On 2015-01-08 11:34, Adam Munich wrote:
>>>> > >> From what I've gathered from his discussions about it there was
>>>> > >> apparently some sort of miscommunication between the people
>>>> > >> running Noisebridge and electricians, which rayc tried to
>>>> > >> resolve. The people who were supposed to be doing the job didn't
>>>> > >> like that somehow.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Granted that's only his side of the story and I don't know the
>>>> > >> other side, but overall rayc has been rather valuable in keeping
>>>> > >> sudo clean and organized. I feel like it's worth giving him a
>>>> > >> chance.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Cheers, -Adam On Jan 8, 2015 11:04 AM, <hol at gaskill.com> wrote:
>>>> > >> It was already blocked by several people due to some concerns -
>>>> > >> among them is that he didn't mention the situation RE Noisebridge
>>>> > >> at all until prompted, which didn't convey a sense of openness
>>>> > >> and honesty. I believe someone is reaching out to him to get more
>>>> > >> info on the situation so probably best not to make it the subject
>>>> > >> of a meeting until there's been a chance to hear everyone out
>>>> > >> offline. I left at 10:30 so may have missed who that was - if it
>>>> > >> wasn't delegated to anyone I'll contact him.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> cheers
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> On 2015-01-08 10:02, Torrie Fischer wrote: Hei, sudo room.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> I want to avoid as much conflict as possible here on discuss@ so
>>>> > >> I'll state up front that I would really rather folks talk to me
>>>> > >> in person or off list in response to this.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> I had every intention of coming to Sudo last night as I
>>>> > >> infrequently do to see whats up and hack on things and spend more
>>>> > >> time in the space. My knee disagreed to I went home instead.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Had I made it I would've certainly blocked RAYC's membership.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> I plan on showing up at Sudo Room next week to have a legitimate
>>>> > >> block in person since phoning it in as I'm doing in this e-mail
>>>> > >> is bullshit and we all know that. I would appreciate it a bunch
>>>> > >> if others were around to hear me elaborate about my principled
>>>> > >> objection and give feedback if it has any standing. I also don't
>>>> > >> think its all that excellent of an idea to try and discuss this
>>>> > >> on a wednesday night when folks want to just get together and be
>>>> > >> positive, so I'll certainly be making more of an effort to be at
>>>> > >> the space before then for discussion.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Again, I'm not going to respond to this on the list but feel free
>>>> > >> to poke me off-list or AFK :)
>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ sudo-discuss
>>>> > >> mailing list sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>> > >> https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss [1]
>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ sudo-discuss
>>>> > >> mailing list sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>> > >> https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss [1]
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Links: ------ [1] https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > > _______________________________________________ sudo-discuss
>>>> > > mailing list sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
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>>>> >
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