[sudo-discuss] [Mesh] Fwd: Re: Server Room Status

Mon Jul 7 15:08:12 PDT 2014

(Also I am thinking, low-power solar fans for mellow airflow into the
basement venting, like the kind had on boats, would be cool.)

On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 3:06 PM, David Keenan <dkeenan44 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Also, re: ventilation in the basement - we have to recconnect the blower
> from the room (the 1'x3' venting) on the east side asap. On the west side,
> there is active cooling on the west side already (2x fans, plus windows
> above the sidewalk. There is also a large lightwell above the barr-room
> bathroom that could probably be easily gotten to. So, re: cool air (without
> a/c) to the servers if they are in the basement, we could pull cool air
> from the street or roof to the cold side of the rack, and vent heat from
> the hot side/top to the existing exhaust venting the furnaces use, or vent
> heat directlty to the basement in the winter, or vent perhaps to that
> lightwell... we can use thermostats in the room to trigger A/C from the
> compressor to the rack only if needed, and use ambient the rest of the time.
>
> In general, the ventilation setup in the basement - what needs to exhaust
> separately, what venting is shared and whence does it come/go - needs to be
> coordinated with the FNB, La Commune, Black Hole, and OOC. It's a
> logistical issue that Sudoers I think would be really good at help sorting
> out, and I would really love it if we could.
>
> As others have stated, we need a working group just for the basement and
> space there to hash out this stuff - plumbing is another equally pressing
> aspect. It's enough work and discussion I think it may be a good idea to
> set up its own email list perhaps on riseup or google, but I am open to
> suggestions about how best to comprise this.
>
> Love
> David
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 2:30 PM, David Keenan <dkeenan44 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Again I am *super* psyched that we are tackling where to rack servers
>> and very grateful to all who are putting energy and effort into this.
>>
>> Whether it be for servers or any other ideas about how to use others'
>> space and shared space, I feel the only real missing piece in the
>> discussion here, and actually to various degrees within pretty much
>> *every* member collective actually, is not keeping in mind any other
>> group's plans or ideas for a given space in the building - especially for
>> their very own space which they have already been promised are technically
>> in possession of.
>>
>> *For sure*, by all means, lets brainstorm about every possible place
>> things like servers could go. If we are imagining the rack should *not*
>> go into sudo/ccl's room (why not?), but rather elsewhere in the building, I
>> think that's a conversation that should include others in the building too,
>> not just sudoers, because it affects others' planning and use of space.
>>
>> The same I feel is true for anyone else's plans to do any build-out, and
>> all buildout really should be discussed within the OOC as a whole. This
>> doesn't have to be a nightmare of endless meetings - its simply a way to
>> try to act in a coordinated and thoughtful manner in concert with other
>> groups in the space.
>>
>> For example, in the hypothetical of Sudo putting a server rack into what
>> is presently another group's dedicated space (Backspace), that particular
>> conversation should be had with that *group* from the get-go. For sure,
>> hash out pros & cons on sudo-discuss, walk the building with other sudoers
>> - yes! - but that discussion should not take place *only* on
>> sudo-discuss (or sudo-mesh), or *only* with other sudoers (me and
>> Andrew). Also, the Backspace area presently needs a lot of work -
>> apparently, many people can only envision as a place for garbage, or to get
>> to utility panels.
>>
>> Just because the Backspace area has not been fixed up yet, does not mean
>> it won't soon be. Backspace area is at a real disadvantage here compared to
>> nearly every other group, and I feel we all must be understanding of this,
>> as Backspace clearly needs more work (and *time* to do that) than pretty
>> much anywhere else in the building. I mean, Backspace has far more intense
>> permitting and structural issues to address - we're getting architectural
>> drawings (I had the architect over yesterday partly for this reason), and
>> planning it out thoughtfully - this is not going to happen in one week or
>> even one month. Also, Backspacers are a much smaller, newer group than
>> Sudo, in which almost everyone has day jobs and simply can't be there alla
>> the time - they are not on sudo-discuss, nor necessarily should they be, at
>> least any more than all of sudo should be on backspace's list.
>>
>> For those that don't know - Backspace Wellness Collective is a
>> regularly-meeting group presently comprised of four healers / bodyworkers,
>> in addition to Andrew and myself: Samantha, Margaretha, Athena, and Sarah.
>> So, the notion of building Sudo stuff into Backspace needs to be discussed
>> extensively with Backspace as a group. I see this model as applying to any
>> group wanting to build out in another group's space.
>>
>> As you can imagine Backspace is having their own internal discussions
>> about how articulate their model, including how best to build out,
>> refinish, and make use of that physical area. Consider that if you blow
>> away part of Backspace's area or an entire room for a different use, you
>> are also potentially actually talking about removing an individual from
>> Backspace, who would have used that room for their practice. I think it
>> might be best to think about the pro's of putting servers into backspace in
>> that way: Do you really feel that strongly about having servers there that
>> you are willing to do ask that of another group? So you see what I mean
>> here.
>>
>> Anyhow, to a less intensive extent that conversation should also be had
>> with the Omni Oakland Commons as a whole (in the omnilogistics list),
>> especially if you see the servers as serving the entire building, not just
>> sudo (which would need to be explained to everyone else too - easily enough
>> done, but the common use of these servers should be clarified.)
>>
>> Regarding server racks specifically and knowing sudo frankly I am
>> somewhat doubtful that racks would be simply be left alone in a
>> set-and-forget mode as much as has been inferred. Rather, I imagine sudo
>> will actually need not-infrequent physical access.. to hack on things,
>> install and upgrade new donated equipment, etc. Therefore they should be in
>> a space where physical access is not an issue, and probably for permitting
>> issues alone not infringe on the area for electrical panels. The electrical
>> panel area should be closeted off no matter what and really never entered
>> unless a breaker is flipped which, with 200A (or is it 240A?) of power and
>> solid distribution throughout the building, and thoughtful planning re:
>> circuit load, I see as being rare. Yes, a number of the circuits are
>> powered off presently throughout the space - we will address that, and then
>> the electrical closet should be rarely entered, if only for safety's sake
>> if nothing else. My 2c.
>>
>> Best,
>> David
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jul 6, 2014 at 6:51 PM, Luis Murillo <luis.murillo.plos at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Hey guys sorry I've been MIA today, been running some errands/TCB will
>>> swing by sudo later tonight and monday night :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jul 6, 2014 at 6:08 PM, Somebody <somebody at riseup.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Excuse me for resending this email treat, but the Sudo-mesh list was not
>>>> linked from the first email that I sent out.
>>>>
>>>> Thx!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject:        Re: [sudo-discuss] Server Room Status
>>>> Date:   Sun, 06 Jul 2014 17:12:03 -0700
>>>> From:   hol at gaskill.com
>>>> To:     David Keenan <dkeenan44 at gmail.com>
>>>> CC:     sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  >the compressor for that could also provide cooling for the servers.
>>>> i think doing experiments on heat recovery and regenerative hx are good
>>>> for longterm - using a compressor and refrigerant to cool hot things may
>>>> be less green than using fans and just circulating fresh cool air and
>>>> letting convection do the work.  if there's no objection, we could set
>>>> up temp racks where daniel and others propose until we can run coax to a
>>>> more optimal area.  i finally have some time this week so i'll be around
>>>> to assist with low-level tasks in support of setting up basic
>>>> infrastructure
>>>>
>>>> cheers
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2014-07-06 10:00, David Keenan wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > hey guys,
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > I applaud the effort to find a good, secure server space! I definitely
>>>> > wanna help.
>>>> >
>>>> > The main issue with using this particular room is, as you can see by
>>>> > looking at the floorplan, the Backspace wellness collective is
>>>> > already paying rent on that particular area (NW groundfloor
>>>> > corner) and will be making their own changes to that space. Backspace
>>>> > is myself, Andrew of course, Margaretha, Athena, and Sarah.
>>>> >
>>>> > The wellness collective needs quiet - thats partly an attraction for
>>>> > that corner of the building - and, a cabinet full of fans plus almost
>>>> > certainly AC for the cabinet, is loud. Also, it takes up Backspace,
>>>> > and to be honest, i have hard time inamagining Sudo wont need to get
>>>> > into it alla the time, so it seems nonideal to me.
>>>> >
>>>> > In general I would think, before using other essentially non-shared
>>>> > areas of the building for Sudo's servers, we would have to
>>>> > actually rule out why building the room in other locations, like Sudo
>>>> > room, wouldnt work, and why we think actually that particular location
>>>> > in someone else's area is really the only place it could work.
>>>> >
>>>> > Regardless of Bsckspace, having racked & stacked for going on 20 years
>>>> > that would not be my first location in the entire building for a lot
>>>> > of reasons.
>>>> >
>>>> > Also, a server cabinet / closet does not need to be near the main
>>>> > electrical panel. Nor does it does not need to be near the street.
>>>> >
>>>> > We could find a room in the basement. There is excellent ventilation
>>>> > to the basement, that just needs a small fix. Also the furnaces are in
>>>> > the basement, and heat from the servers could tap into that venting to
>>>> > actually help heat the building, which could save on energy. Also,
>>>> > there is a plan to build a walk-in in the basement - the compressor
>>>> > for that could also provide cooling for the servers.
>>>> >
>>>> > In other words, in my view, we should attempt a green solution that
>>>> > ties the serbers into the infrastructure for the building.
>>>> >
>>>> > :)
>>>> > d
>>>> >
>>>> > On Saturday, July 5, 2014, Somebody <somebody at riseup.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > === SERVER ROOM UPDATES ===
>>>> > 2014/07/05:
>>>> > Today Luis, Matt, and I did the walk in the building, and so far the
>>>> > only place that seems the
>>>> > most appropriate to have the server room is the room by the bar.
>>>> >
>>>> > This area is the most ideal in the whole building because the air
>>>> > flow,
>>>> > temperature, electricity proximity, and also because it is where the
>>>> > Internet access enters the building.
>>>> >
>>>> > Since this area is not is not part of the SudoRoom space, we will have
>>>> > to talk about it with the rest of the Sudo-Mesh group and the group
>>>> > approves it, then we would have to present the idea at our
>>>> > Omni Collective meeting for approval.
>>>> >
>>>> > If approved by the Omni Collective, we would need to build:
>>>> >
>>>> > * A 2" or so high floor (two by fours and plywood would do, I believe.
>>>> > * A 55" x 65" cage with chicken wire walls and a door.
>>>> >
>>>> > If this place is NOT approved by the OOC then perhaps we should
>>>> > consider
>>>> > building the Server Room in the SudoRoom Space. High temperature and
>>>> > noise levels are the main issues.
>>>> >
>>>> > If others have ideas/comments/or want to be part of this process
>>>> > please
>>>> > jump in. You may contact Matt, Luis, or myself (Daniel).
>>>> >
>>>> > This update and all other Network/Reboot project is found at:
>>>> > https://sudoroom.org/mediawiki/index.php?title=Network/Reboot
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > This update and all other Network/Reboot project is found at:
>>>> > https://sudoroom.org/wiki/Network/Reboot
>>>> >
>>>> > Thx!
>>>> >
>>>> >     _______________________________________________
>>>> >     sudo-discuss mailing list
>>>> >     sudo-discuss at lists.sudoroom.org
>>>> >     https://lists.sudoroom.org/listinfo/sudo-discuss
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
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>>
>
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